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	<title>Comments on: Is KeyAni a bad thing?</title>
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	<link>http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/</link>
	<description>WITCHES DON’T REFO~RM☆</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 22:22:48 +0800</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: sagematt</title>
		<link>http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/comment-page-2/#comment-56466</link>
		<dc:creator>sagematt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Mar 2007 15:14:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/#comment-56466</guid>
		<description>He talks as if fanservice is a sin. He believes morals should take an integral part on each animated show.

Sure, that&#039;s only on your own utopic world. In this one, whatever makes the most profit, is the winning formula. Fanservice is proving to be a winning formula for most animation studios. Would that formula change in a near future? Maybe, and if it does, I&#039;m all for it. It&#039;s not like fanservice is a panacea, and this has been proven by myriads of god-awful fanservice-filled shows.

A paradigm shift? Yes, it will happen. We are actually experiencing that process. But KyoAni is just joining the best of two worlds. The fanservice is still an integral part of it. And also, the perfect hook.

Best regards.

*quickly wears his asbestos suit*

ps. Also, source material also plays an integral part. At first, we always got manga-anime conversions (and book-anime conversions too, but I won&#039;t get started on that). Then, eroge-anime conversions came along. Now, non-ero visual novel to anime conversions are already happening, along with lots of ero and non ero novels to anime. So, we&#039;ve got lots of diversity, now it&#039;s only a matter of choosing our favorite poison.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>He talks as if fanservice is a sin. He believes morals should take an integral part on each animated show.</p>
<p>Sure, that&#8217;s only on your own utopic world. In this one, whatever makes the most profit, is the winning formula. Fanservice is proving to be a winning formula for most animation studios. Would that formula change in a near future? Maybe, and if it does, I&#8217;m all for it. It&#8217;s not like fanservice is a panacea, and this has been proven by myriads of god-awful fanservice-filled shows.</p>
<p>A paradigm shift? Yes, it will happen. We are actually experiencing that process. But KyoAni is just joining the best of two worlds. The fanservice is still an integral part of it. And also, the perfect hook.</p>
<p>Best regards.</p>
<p>*quickly wears his asbestos suit*</p>
<p>ps. Also, source material also plays an integral part. At first, we always got manga-anime conversions (and book-anime conversions too, but I won&#8217;t get started on that). Then, eroge-anime conversions came along. Now, non-ero visual novel to anime conversions are already happening, along with lots of ero and non ero novels to anime. So, we&#8217;ve got lots of diversity, now it&#8217;s only a matter of choosing our favorite poison.</p>
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		<title>By: jaalin</title>
		<link>http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/comment-page-2/#comment-56414</link>
		<dc:creator>jaalin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Mar 2007 22:28:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/#comment-56414</guid>
		<description>lolikit&#039;s really at my jugular for this one, lol

As with most of my posts, they&#039;re meant to be taken as a whole package - breaking it down into specific parts isn&#039;t the way I intended it to be read.  The piece was written to show my initial bias with the genre, then eventually applying a rational analysis at the end to elucidate the &quot;paradigm shift&quot; that KeyAni has brought about.  It&#039;s like you said - KyoAni is breathing life back into the genre, making it less about the fanservice and cheap indulgences (the &quot;lower morality) and focusing more on the depth of the relationships.  The way I see it, studios have just settled into the fanservice formula for these shows because it&#039;s guaranteed money, to the point where the plot takes a back seat to a snazzy new character design - Kanon 2006 sets a new standard by reminding everyone that a truly worthy show is propelled by its plot and its relationships, not by whether she&#039;s wearing white or striped or kuma-san pantsu.  As I like to put it, there&#039;s just no integrity, no &quot;moral standard&quot; in doing that - is the show so boring that fanservice has to be used to keep audiences interested?  (Shuffle and Da Capo being two of the biggest sinners here)

For this reason I chose to use the word &quot;chaser&quot; at the end - the sweet, fruity juice to wash down the burning hard vodka to make the whole drink enjoyable, rather than leave a bad taste in your mouth.  


Keep in mind, my opinion is just that - my opinion - it&#039;s not there to offend anyone or to rub anyone the wrong way, only there to provide my own unique angle of approach to evaluate what will surely be one of the most memorable and influential anime of our generation.

-jaalin</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>lolikit&#8217;s really at my jugular for this one, lol</p>
<p>As with most of my posts, they&#8217;re meant to be taken as a whole package &#8211; breaking it down into specific parts isn&#8217;t the way I intended it to be read.  The piece was written to show my initial bias with the genre, then eventually applying a rational analysis at the end to elucidate the &#8220;paradigm shift&#8221; that KeyAni has brought about.  It&#8217;s like you said &#8211; KyoAni is breathing life back into the genre, making it less about the fanservice and cheap indulgences (the &#8220;lower morality) and focusing more on the depth of the relationships.  The way I see it, studios have just settled into the fanservice formula for these shows because it&#8217;s guaranteed money, to the point where the plot takes a back seat to a snazzy new character design &#8211; Kanon 2006 sets a new standard by reminding everyone that a truly worthy show is propelled by its plot and its relationships, not by whether she&#8217;s wearing white or striped or kuma-san pantsu.  As I like to put it, there&#8217;s just no integrity, no &#8220;moral standard&#8221; in doing that &#8211; is the show so boring that fanservice has to be used to keep audiences interested?  (Shuffle and Da Capo being two of the biggest sinners here)</p>
<p>For this reason I chose to use the word &#8220;chaser&#8221; at the end &#8211; the sweet, fruity juice to wash down the burning hard vodka to make the whole drink enjoyable, rather than leave a bad taste in your mouth.  </p>
<p>Keep in mind, my opinion is just that &#8211; my opinion &#8211; it&#8217;s not there to offend anyone or to rub anyone the wrong way, only there to provide my own unique angle of approach to evaluate what will surely be one of the most memorable and influential anime of our generation.</p>
<p>-jaalin</p>
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		<title>By: sagematt</title>
		<link>http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/comment-page-1/#comment-56364</link>
		<dc:creator>sagematt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Mar 2007 04:35:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/#comment-56364</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Discreet? What the hell is discreet about it?&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Whoops, my bad. Wrong use of a term.
That proves I can&#039;t be both working and posting ¬_¬
(It&#039;s funny that he read my whole comment, though)

Ok, so I tried reading all the comments, but I just couldn&#039;t. Maybe if I catch the discussion before it gets heated. Anyways...

&lt;blockquote&gt;Oh my, the comments thread on that post is EPIC.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Tell me about it:

&lt;em&gt;Love Hina, Shuffle, and now Kanon are 3 best made harem animes&lt;/em&gt;

lolwut?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Discreet? What the hell is discreet about it?</p></blockquote>
<p>Whoops, my bad. Wrong use of a term.<br />
That proves I can&#8217;t be both working and posting ¬_¬<br />
(It&#8217;s funny that he read my whole comment, though)</p>
<p>Ok, so I tried reading all the comments, but I just couldn&#8217;t. Maybe if I catch the discussion before it gets heated. Anyways&#8230;</p>
<blockquote><p>Oh my, the comments thread on that post is EPIC.</p></blockquote>
<p>Tell me about it:</p>
<p><em>Love Hina, Shuffle, and now Kanon are 3 best made harem animes</em></p>
<p>lolwut?</p>
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		<title>By: &#8220;WE ARE FUCKING NOT DOTQ. THIS TIME SERIOUSLY.&#8221; &#187; Blog Archive &#187; loldebate</title>
		<link>http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/comment-page-1/#comment-56361</link>
		<dc:creator>&#8220;WE ARE FUCKING NOT DOTQ. THIS TIME SERIOUSLY.&#8221; &#187; Blog Archive &#187; loldebate</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Mar 2007 03:48:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/#comment-56361</guid>
		<description>[...] Man, everyone&#8217;s yammering on about Kyoto Animation. (Hopefully, that was in chronological order&#8230;) [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Man, everyone&#8217;s yammering on about Kyoto Animation. (Hopefully, that was in chronological order&#8230;) [...]</p>
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		<title>By: lolikitsune</title>
		<link>http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/comment-page-1/#comment-56360</link>
		<dc:creator>lolikitsune</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Mar 2007 03:44:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/#comment-56360</guid>
		<description>And I&#039;ll be glad to play my part again too. Quite glad, because everything I said about you guys? I could say it about myself, too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And I&#8217;ll be glad to play my part again too. Quite glad, because everything I said about you guys? I could say it about myself, too.</p>
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		<title>By: Kurogane Shiroikaze</title>
		<link>http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/comment-page-1/#comment-56352</link>
		<dc:creator>Kurogane Shiroikaze</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Mar 2007 02:22:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/#comment-56352</guid>
		<description>@LOLikit: 2nd best comment of the post ever. Yeah I love the seeing how influential I am after this post XD.

I guess this issue has been blown out of proportion (as most blogger dorama tends to become) but I&#039;m still glad to have made my point. So the next time people start to hypocritically bitch about the animation studio when in reality, they just can&#039;t like the show, I&#039;ll be glad to make my point again.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@LOLikit: 2nd best comment of the post ever. Yeah I love the seeing how influential I am after this post XD.</p>
<p>I guess this issue has been blown out of proportion (as most blogger dorama tends to become) but I&#8217;m still glad to have made my point. So the next time people start to hypocritically bitch about the animation studio when in reality, they just can&#8217;t like the show, I&#8217;ll be glad to make my point again.</p>
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		<title>By: lolikitsune</title>
		<link>http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/comment-page-1/#comment-56346</link>
		<dc:creator>lolikitsune</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Mar 2007 23:31:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/#comment-56346</guid>
		<description>&gt;&gt;the discreet but generous ammounts of fanservice…

Discreet? What the hell is discreet about it?

&gt;&gt;So, let’s just stop the flaming.

But everyone&#039;s enjoying this! Jaalin likes the attention, Kurogane likes the influence, tj han likes the drama, Dream Chaser likes the bitching opportunity, Stripey likes the chance to sound scholarly, DKellis likes that he can ping other blogs by posting his response, thereby becoming better-known, Lupus liked the post fodder, and I... I&#039;m really being an ass, aren&#039;t I?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;&gt;the discreet but generous ammounts of fanservice…</p>
<p>Discreet? What the hell is discreet about it?</p>
<p>&gt;&gt;So, let’s just stop the flaming.</p>
<p>But everyone&#8217;s enjoying this! Jaalin likes the attention, Kurogane likes the influence, tj han likes the drama, Dream Chaser likes the bitching opportunity, Stripey likes the chance to sound scholarly, DKellis likes that he can ping other blogs by posting his response, thereby becoming better-known, Lupus liked the post fodder, and I&#8230; I&#8217;m really being an ass, aren&#8217;t I?</p>
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		<title>By: Danny</title>
		<link>http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/comment-page-1/#comment-56344</link>
		<dc:creator>Danny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Mar 2007 23:11:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/#comment-56344</guid>
		<description>i certainly wouldnt say that kyoani is wasting there time with a show like Kanon (or Key), but i wonder how I would feel if they ended up making 10 of them? (are there even 10 key games?) it would be so much nicer if kyoani did anime of all genres. what used to be badly animated not-funny fanservice became a romantic drama that was kanon (im talking about harem here, even though i wouldnt say kanon is strictly harem), so what about a short action-shounen? nooooow dont call me crazy for suggesting something like that, but a lot of the shounen we see now are pretty mediocre. im also just curious to see what a shounen by kyoani would be. in fact, i would love to see a show of all genres by kyoani to see what they are like. so far, we have the key-romance-drama type show like Air and Kanon, the uber-awesome school life show Haruhi, mecha/comedy FMP fumoffu and TSR, and it looks like soon to come, slapstick/slice of life lucky star? and the opposite of shounen, i would loove to see a good shoujo school life romance by kyoani.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i certainly wouldnt say that kyoani is wasting there time with a show like Kanon (or Key), but i wonder how I would feel if they ended up making 10 of them? (are there even 10 key games?) it would be so much nicer if kyoani did anime of all genres. what used to be badly animated not-funny fanservice became a romantic drama that was kanon (im talking about harem here, even though i wouldnt say kanon is strictly harem), so what about a short action-shounen? nooooow dont call me crazy for suggesting something like that, but a lot of the shounen we see now are pretty mediocre. im also just curious to see what a shounen by kyoani would be. in fact, i would love to see a show of all genres by kyoani to see what they are like. so far, we have the key-romance-drama type show like Air and Kanon, the uber-awesome school life show Haruhi, mecha/comedy FMP fumoffu and TSR, and it looks like soon to come, slapstick/slice of life lucky star? and the opposite of shounen, i would loove to see a good shoujo school life romance by kyoani.</p>
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		<title>By: sagematt</title>
		<link>http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/comment-page-1/#comment-56339</link>
		<dc:creator>sagematt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Mar 2007 22:06:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/#comment-56339</guid>
		<description>Now, regarding jaalin&#039;s post (I&#039;m at work, and currently on a break, I have nothing better to do):

&lt;blockquote&gt;I think it’s a total waste of ability and resources. A studio of KyoAni’s caliber shouldn’t be doing harem shows&lt;/blockquote&gt;

That is entirely his own opinion, KyoAni should decide on making whatever show makes the most profit for them. It&#039;s the only choice you are allowed to take on any company, I don&#039;t see why it should apply differently on that market.


&lt;blockquote&gt;which have traditionally just been there for the sake of showing off some more girls in maid outfits or nekomimi or some other ridiculous stuff like that.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

It&#039;s entertainment. Whatever floats your boat...

&lt;blockquote&gt;Not that I don’t appreciate it – it’s just something I feel is better left to the “lesser” studios and not the &lt;strong&gt;oharuhiliness&lt;/strong&gt; that is Kyoto Animation. If my understanding is correct, the main reason they picked up Kanon was because of the success of their initial venture into the visual novel genre, AIR.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

This is the part that confuses me. He is ranting about the nature of harem shows, while making note of the &lt;strong&gt;oharuhiliness&lt;/strong&gt; of KyoAni. Perhaps we should remind him of the heavy harem dynamics in the show (Kyon&#039;s POV or Haruhi&#039;s POV), about the costume raping of Mikuru, the discreet but generous ammounts of fanservice... 

Maybe I missed what he meant by &quot;oharuhiliness&quot;. Maybe &quot;oharuhiliness&quot; doesn&#039;t include fanservice... Yet, Haruhi without fanservice would be... &quot;irrelevant&quot;. Yes, that&#039;s the word. I&#039;m not saying it&#039;s what makes Haruhi special, but it&#039;s an integral part in such feat. That, and its harem dynamics.

Anyways, at the very end, after flaming Kanon throughly, he ends up saying that it is a &lt;em&gt;&quot;superbly produced series&quot;&lt;/em&gt;. So I think the conclusion here is: tl;dr - &lt;strong&gt;&lt;em&gt;He is just a harem hater who just wanted to rant about &quot;harem&quot; in general, but concludes that &quot;harem&quot; made by KyoAni is a superb product&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/strong&gt;.

So, let&#039;s just stop the flaming. Differing opinions, KyoAni wins, let&#039;s move on.

(I&#039;ll rant about Kuro&#039;s post later, at home)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Now, regarding jaalin&#8217;s post (I&#8217;m at work, and currently on a break, I have nothing better to do):</p>
<blockquote><p>I think it’s a total waste of ability and resources. A studio of KyoAni’s caliber shouldn’t be doing harem shows</p></blockquote>
<p>That is entirely his own opinion, KyoAni should decide on making whatever show makes the most profit for them. It&#8217;s the only choice you are allowed to take on any company, I don&#8217;t see why it should apply differently on that market.</p>
<blockquote><p>which have traditionally just been there for the sake of showing off some more girls in maid outfits or nekomimi or some other ridiculous stuff like that.</p></blockquote>
<p>It&#8217;s entertainment. Whatever floats your boat&#8230;</p>
<blockquote><p>Not that I don’t appreciate it – it’s just something I feel is better left to the “lesser” studios and not the <strong>oharuhiliness</strong> that is Kyoto Animation. If my understanding is correct, the main reason they picked up Kanon was because of the success of their initial venture into the visual novel genre, AIR.</p></blockquote>
<p>This is the part that confuses me. He is ranting about the nature of harem shows, while making note of the <strong>oharuhiliness</strong> of KyoAni. Perhaps we should remind him of the heavy harem dynamics in the show (Kyon&#8217;s POV or Haruhi&#8217;s POV), about the costume raping of Mikuru, the discreet but generous ammounts of fanservice&#8230; </p>
<p>Maybe I missed what he meant by &#8220;oharuhiliness&#8221;. Maybe &#8220;oharuhiliness&#8221; doesn&#8217;t include fanservice&#8230; Yet, Haruhi without fanservice would be&#8230; &#8220;irrelevant&#8221;. Yes, that&#8217;s the word. I&#8217;m not saying it&#8217;s what makes Haruhi special, but it&#8217;s an integral part in such feat. That, and its harem dynamics.</p>
<p>Anyways, at the very end, after flaming Kanon throughly, he ends up saying that it is a <em>&#8220;superbly produced series&#8221;</em>. So I think the conclusion here is: tl;dr &#8211; <strong><em>He is just a harem hater who just wanted to rant about &#8220;harem&#8221; in general, but concludes that &#8220;harem&#8221; made by KyoAni is a superb product</em></strong>.</p>
<p>So, let&#8217;s just stop the flaming. Differing opinions, KyoAni wins, let&#8217;s move on.</p>
<p>(I&#8217;ll rant about Kuro&#8217;s post later, at home)</p>
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		<title>By: &#8220;WE ARE FUCKING NOT DOTQ. THIS TIME SERIOUSLY.&#8221; &#187; Blog Archive &#187; In Review: Saigar 2007</title>
		<link>http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/comment-page-1/#comment-56338</link>
		<dc:creator>&#8220;WE ARE FUCKING NOT DOTQ. THIS TIME SERIOUSLY.&#8221; &#187; Blog Archive &#187; In Review: Saigar 2007</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Mar 2007 21:23:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/03/22/is-keyani-a-bad-thing/#comment-56338</guid>
		<description>[...] I&#8217;m not going to bitch about how Saigar was one of the most idiotic things I&#8217;ve ever subjected myself to (up there with watching Soul Link and Suzumiya Haruhi no Yuuutsu). I&#8217;m not going to bitch about how I want more attention. I&#8217;m not going to bitch about how Drm is still the only good anime blogger. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] I&#8217;m not going to bitch about how Saigar was one of the most idiotic things I&#8217;ve ever subjected myself to (up there with watching Soul Link and Suzumiya Haruhi no Yuuutsu). I&#8217;m not going to bitch about how I want more attention. I&#8217;m not going to bitch about how Drm is still the only good anime blogger. [...]</p>
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